Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling

Axis new "B" series foils and 980 front wing

Reply
Created by wicka > 9 months ago, 21 Nov 2020
Bazzacuda
NSW, 23 posts
21 Dec 2020 7:04PM
Thumbs Up




New B series 700 bottom left, HS1050 mid right, and HS1250 upper left. Will be interesting to hear the feedback when it hits the water soon. Super thin profile, and bigger sizes are on the way.

Piros
QLD, 6879 posts
21 Dec 2020 7:00PM
Thumbs Up

Yeah there is ton more Axis Blacks coming out , this will be interesting . The cm2 area will become a thing of the past . As the new HA , Mid aspect wings will have alot more and lift and carry from the lower aspect wings , they are now so much more efficient . Don't want to get into aspect ratios as it's so confusing .

We tend to label wings high , low or mid aspect due to width and cord . The Axis 1010 we classed as high aspect but it's really not at best it's a higher aspect is a good example of what I'm talking about . The new blacks are much thinner with slightly wider width and but narrower cord but the cm2 is not that much less but they have a much higher lift & carry still similar to the 1000 or 900 in area but so much more performance.

So you need to let go of the 1000 , 1100 , 1200 , 1400 or 2000cm2 ect . Part of the reason GoFoil never post area . Best advice try before you buy , you'll be surprised you could ride something based on low numbers that you think you never could .

frenchfoiler
498 posts
21 Dec 2020 5:22PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Piros said..
Yeah there is ton more Axis Blacks coming out , this will be interesting . The cm2 area will become a thing of the past . As the new HA , Mid aspect wings will have alot more and lift and carry from the lower aspect wings , they are now so much more efficient . Don't want to get into aspect ratios as it's so confusing .

We tend to label wings high , low or mid aspect due to width and cord . The Axis 1010 we classed as high aspect but it's really not at best it's a higher aspect is a good example of what I'm talking about . The new blacks are much thinner with slightly wider width and but narrower cord but the cm2 is not that much less but they have a much higher lift & carry still similar to the 1000 or 900 in area but so much more performance.

So you need to let go of the 1000 , 1100 , 1200 , 1400 or 2000cm2 ect . Part of the reason GoFoil never post area . Best advice try before you buy , you'll be surprised you could ride something based on low numbers that you think you never could .


I agree, and the more you get better the more you can get small wings.

emmafoils
307 posts
21 Dec 2020 6:07PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Piros said..
Yeah there is ton more Axis Blacks coming out , this will be interesting . The cm2 area will become a thing of the past . As the new HA , Mid aspect wings will have alot more and lift and carry from the lower aspect wings , they are now so much more efficient . Don't want to get into aspect ratios as it's so confusing .

We tend to label wings high , low or mid aspect due to width and cord . The Axis 1010 we classed as high aspect but it's really not at best it's a higher aspect is a good example of what I'm talking about . The new blacks are much thinner with slightly wider width and but narrower cord but the cm2 is not that much less but they have a much higher lift & carry still similar to the 1000 or 900 in area but so much more performance.

So you need to let go of the 1000 , 1100 , 1200 , 1400 or 2000cm2 ect . Part of the reason GoFoil never post area . Best advice try before you buy , you'll be surprised you could ride something based on low numbers that you think you never could .


I agree that foil design is changing very quickly and SA means less when you are comparing very different wings across brands but it still has value when comparing within a brand, especially if they have similar foil sections and aspect ratios. The math will always matter with foils and I applaud Axis for printing them on every foil. (I have tried many different foils but will never consider Gofoil because I like to know what I am riding).

There are a lot of performance characteristics we care about but first and foremost, the foil has to lift and all foils obey the lift equation, including the new Blacks. They cannot have less SA and have thinner sections and have more lift for a given velocity in the same medium (water). The easy lift you guys are reporting with the Blacks is probably due to ease of acceleration due to low drag and getting the Velocity up (which is squared in the lift equation, so it makes the biggest difference). I look forward to trying them soon.

hilly
TAS, 7195 posts
21 Dec 2020 9:29PM
Thumbs Up

Larry Foiler (Shannon) on the b series 700 i think

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
21 Dec 2020 9:46PM
Thumbs Up



Looks like there's going to be an insane number of Black series HPS (High Performance Speed) wings next year: 700, 880, 930, 980 and 1050.

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
21 Dec 2020 10:04PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Piros said..
Yeah there is ton more Axis Blacks coming out , this will be interesting . The cm2 area will become a thing of the past . As the new HA , Mid aspect wings will have alot more and lift and carry from the lower aspect wings , they are now so much more efficient . Don't want to get into aspect ratios as it's so confusing .

We tend to label wings high , low or mid aspect due to width and cord . The Axis 1010 we classed as high aspect but it's really not at best it's a higher aspect is a good example of what I'm talking about . The new blacks are much thinner with slightly wider width and but narrower cord but the cm2 is not that much less but they have a much higher lift & carry still similar to the 1000 or 900 in area but so much more performance.

So you need to let go of the 1000 , 1100 , 1200 , 1400 or 2000cm2 ect . Part of the reason GoFoil never post area . Best advice try before you buy , you'll be surprised you could ride something based on low numbers that you think you never could .


That's a pretty good summary. That's why the 980 was a bit too much for me at 77kg in over 20kn and I'd be looking at the smaller sizes for those windy conditions.
980 is fantastic in light winds though

DWF
565 posts
21 Dec 2020 8:22PM
Thumbs Up

volume might be the new way to judge front wings

kobo
NSW, 1064 posts
22 Dec 2020 6:44AM
Thumbs Up

Axis are incredible at producing new wings, I've lost track of the number and type of wings they have.
I guess the moulds to make the wings would be less complex/cheaper and faster to produce than most other brands,
But even similar brands that would use a simple mould as well, like NP and Naish don't pump out anywhere near the number of wings axis do.

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
22 Dec 2020 1:37PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
kobo said..
Axis are incredible at producing new wings, I've lost track of the number and type of wings they have.
I guess the moulds to make the wings would be less complex/cheaper and faster to produce than most other brands,
But even similar brands that would use a simple mould as well, like NP and Naish don't pump out anywhere near the number of wings axis do.


it's good but also bad as it creates a lot of confusion for many... axis needs to give their website a serious update to matchup the wings.

jatem
13 posts
24 Dec 2020 8:45AM
Thumbs Up

I'd like to know if a 980 would replace my 1010 for SUP and downwind, or if it has a much higher stall speed. I also have no idea which size to get for kiting in waves, and prone surfing at mid 70kg weight? I'd like more speed and turning than the 1010 for kiting. I'd also like less paddling effort on SUP.

Hdip
384 posts
24 Dec 2020 9:27AM
Thumbs Up

Taken from another forum. This helped clarify a bit about what #'s go where. www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35177.msg424439/topicseen.html#new

890 and 810 are the ones that have really had me stoked. He didn't mention it in the video but these two wings are part of a new Broad Spectrum Carve series where the 700, 980 and 1050 are part of the High Performance Speed Series.

There are the two new series (Broad Spectrum Carve and High Performance Speed) and the previous series as well:

910, 1010, 1150 etc. are part of a series called "Pump and Glide".

860, 760, 660, "Performance Surf"

900 and 1000, "Original Carve"

1020, 920 ect., "Original All Around"

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
24 Dec 2020 1:41PM
Thumbs Up

Yeah that's a good thread of info, been following it and took me weeks to register.

The consensus seems to be that short fuse is the way to go for wing and it needs a flat stabiliser.

Very keen to see how this goes vs Unifoil hyper.

Holoholo
185 posts
24 Dec 2020 11:24AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Hdip said..
Taken from another forum. This helped clarify a bit about what #'s go where. www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35177.msg424439/topicseen.html#new

890 and 810 are the ones that have really had me stoked. He didn't mention it in the video but these two wings are part of a new Broad Spectrum Carve series where the 700, 980 and 1050 are part of the High Performance Speed Series.

There are the two new series (Broad Spectrum Carve and High Performance Speed) and the previous series as well:

910, 1010, 1150 etc. are part of a series called "Pump and Glide".

860, 760, 660, "Performance Surf"

900 and 1000, "Original Carve"

1020, 920 ect., "Original All Around"


Chomping at the bit to get my hands on the 890 and 810 as well. Wondering which would be the daily driver... if the 810 will have enough lift for my 90kg in smaller conditions. I currently prone surf the 900 90% of the time but want something that turns better and hope the810 fits that niche. Have had my eye on the 760- but think Imayneed headlights to enjoy it.

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
24 Dec 2020 10:42PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Holoholo said..

Hdip said..
Taken from another forum. This helped clarify a bit about what #'s go where. www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35177.msg424439/topicseen.html#new

890 and 810 are the ones that have really had me stoked. He didn't mention it in the video but these two wings are part of a new Broad Spectrum Carve series where the 700, 980 and 1050 are part of the High Performance Speed Series.

There are the two new series (Broad Spectrum Carve and High Performance Speed) and the previous series as well:

910, 1010, 1150 etc. are part of a series called "Pump and Glide".

860, 760, 660, "Performance Surf"

900 and 1000, "Original Carve"

1020, 920 ect., "Original All Around"



Chomping at the bit to get my hands on the 890 and 810 as well. Wondering which would be the daily driver... if the 810 will have enough lift for my 90kg in smaller conditions. I currently prone surf the 900 90% of the time but want something that turns better and hope the810 fits that niche. Have had my eye on the 760- but think Imayneed headlights to enjoy it.


I doubt any of the black series will turn better than the 900 which has well down turned tips. The question is whether any of the performance surf S series will be made for the black series and whether the BSC wings will turn well, we'll see...

Holoholo
185 posts
25 Dec 2020 1:42AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Alysum said..

Holoholo said..


Hdip said..
Taken from another forum. This helped clarify a bit about what #'s go where. www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35177.msg424439/topicseen.html#new

890 and 810 are the ones that have really had me stoked. He didn't mention it in the video but these two wings are part of a new Broad Spectrum Carve series where the 700, 980 and 1050 are part of the High Performance Speed Series.

There are the two new series (Broad Spectrum Carve and High Performance Speed) and the previous series as well:

910, 1010, 1150 etc. are part of a series called "Pump and Glide".

860, 760, 660, "Performance Surf"

900 and 1000, "Original Carve"

1020, 920 ect., "Original All Around"




Chomping at the bit to get my hands on the 890 and 810 as well. Wondering which would be the daily driver... if the 810 will have enough lift for my 90kg in smaller conditions. I currently prone surf the 900 90% of the time but want something that turns better and hope the810 fits that niche. Have had my eye on the 760- but think Imayneed headlights to enjoy it.



I doubt any of the black series will turn better than the 900 which has well down turned tips. The question is whether any of the performance surf S series will be made for the black series and whether the BSC wings will turn well, we'll see...


I dunno- I am quite likely completely full of S but my thinking is: the BSC aren't dead flat- they do have some anhedral and.... W/ the smaller wingspan- I suspect the 810 will turn a fair bit better than the 900. Seems even the Very flat higher aspect wings have a critical point in diminishing wingspan where they become muuuch more lively in the turns. Take the 980 Kujira that does not have any extreme curve anhedral or tips as a case in point- by all accounts- this wing turns a dream. I am a far cry from an aeronautical engineer but... all kinds of early assumptions regarding area, shape etc are turning out to be not necessarily true. Guess we'll see!

Thatspec
327 posts
27 Dec 2020 12:46AM
Thumbs Up

Yup, many seem to think the 910 turns 'better' than the 900 and this should not be just to look at them both. Anhedral clearly isn't the only criteria.

There are a couple of other BSC's listed as well for normal sized folks;

Front Wing 1120 - BSC - Carbon 1120mm x 220mm / Medium Aspect
Front Wing 1060 - BSC - Carbon 1060mm x 200mm / Medium Aspect (replaces the 1020mm Wing Classic)

shaka808
21 posts
27 Dec 2020 8:18AM
Thumbs Up

The 980 turns heaps better than the 900. No comparison at all. The 980 turns very similar to the 910, however it is much faster (faster even than the 900).

flkiter
84 posts
27 Dec 2020 9:00AM
Thumbs Up

I agree with shaka, the 980 carves really tight and with great glide and speed over the 900. And for the 1060, I would say it replaces the 920 based on surface area and the 1120 will be the equivalent to the 1020 just based on the surface area. This doesn't relate to the actual performance, speed, low end, top end, ect.
The HPS foils have a little twist in the tips so it really helps push in the turns, even the 1050 lets me turn several times quickly on a smaller wave.
I've been running the HPS wings on ultra short fuselage with 370 rear, I'll have my hands on a crazy short next week.

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
28 Dec 2020 5:26PM
Thumbs Up

I didn't think the 980 carved more tight compared to my 1000... It doesn't carve it "skids" underwater, hard to explain, very different feeling of turning.

Piros
QLD, 6879 posts
28 Dec 2020 4:33PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Alysum said..
I didn't think the 980 carved more tight compared to my 1000... It doesn't carve it "skids" underwater, hard to explain, very different feeling of turning.



100% agree you need the 390 turned down tail but it also lifts the tail so not perfect . My mate is getting a custom Kane de Wilde tail for his 980 which should do the trick . Arrives next week , report back then .

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
28 Dec 2020 9:02PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Piros said..


Alysum said..
I didn't think the 980 carved more tight compared to my 1000... It doesn't carve it "skids" underwater, hard to explain, very different feeling of turning.





100% agree you need the 390 turned down tail but it also lifts the tail so not perfect . My mate is getting a custom Kane de Wilde tail for his 980 which should do the trick . Arrives next week , report back then .



Yeah I'm actually on the 390 tail.

It was causing lots of pulses with the 980 even without the rear shim. I think it needs flat tails only to reduce the pitching but then that means less turning hmmm. Keen to hear about the Kane and the new 420 tail.

flkiter
84 posts
28 Dec 2020 11:24PM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
Alysum said..
I didn't think the 980 carved more tight compared to my 1000... It doesn't carve it "skids" underwater, hard to explain, very different feeling of turning.

Are you using the 420 rear? I've felt the slide with that tail so I'm using the 370 instead.

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
29 Dec 2020 8:40AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
flkiter said..

Alysum said..
I didn't think the 980 carved more tight compared to my 1000... It doesn't carve it "skids" underwater, hard to explain, very different feeling of turning.


Are you using the 420 rear? I've felt the slide with that tail so I'm using the 370 instead.


See previous message. 390.

Thatspec
327 posts
29 Dec 2020 11:57PM
Thumbs Up



jimmysturn
WA, 4 posts
30 Dec 2020 8:28AM
Thumbs Up

Anyone know anything about the new Axis Carbon masts? Apparently new manufacturer. Can we expect any changes? anyone got an idea on $ and or photos?

DWF
565 posts
30 Dec 2020 10:24AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
jimmysturn said..
Anyone know anything about the new Axis Carbon masts? Apparently new manufacturer. Can we expect any changes? anyone got an idea on $ and or photos?


I have one. It's 86 cm. Slotted bolts holes are standard. That is the best way to spot one.

jimmysturn
WA, 4 posts
30 Dec 2020 10:28AM
Thumbs Up

Select to expand quote
DWF said..


jimmysturn said..
Anyone know anything about the new Axis Carbon masts? Apparently new manufacturer. Can we expect any changes? anyone got an idea on $ and or photos?




I have one. It's 86 cm. Slotted bolts holes are standard. That is the best way to spot one.



Awesome news about the slotted bolts. So word is they are just a prototype before pushing the button on full scale production. So it could be a while before any Axis carbon masts hit the market!

Alysum
NSW, 1024 posts
30 Dec 2020 11:34PM
Thumbs Up

And covers are apparently an additional cost

Don't expect any significant weight difference to al

jatem
13 posts
31 Dec 2020 7:29AM
Thumbs Up

Do you notice any difference in paddling speed with the 980 compared to the 1010?

I've been wondering if the 420 tail would provide some additional directional stability compared to my 370 when paddling, with winglets and being near the rear of the board?



Subscribe
Reply

Forums > Stand Up Paddle Foiling


"Axis new "B" series foils and 980 front wing" started by wicka